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Grappling Hook Exploit Hypocrisy
#21
I dont think the Grappling hook is used much by Traitors outside of a select few maps, while Detects usually buy one to dick around, wich by the way kills them more then I would like... Not to mention most areas reached by the grappling hook can be reached with propsurfing albeit it takes a bit more time messing with the props and all. So while people would be upset of its removal I doubt much gameplay gets significantly altered by its removal. On the other hand we have the Jumppack, wich has become a well renowed item and if its removed or altered it can significantly alter gameplay from what we have now wich in my opinion will affect the server negatively, or at least the most negative out of the solutions I can see so far.

Forcing staff to be on their toes watching for people abusing the exploits is... Lets just say I dont think that'll work. And if we allow them we're a bunch of hypocrites for allowing exploits onto the server.

Questioning if it should or shouldn't be allowed isnt in my mind whatsoever because I am heavily convinced that as an exploit, it shouldnt be allowed at all.
Resigned Staff since 03-26-2018.
#22
(10-17-2018, 08:53 AM)King Tiger Ace Fasda22 Wrote: I dont think the Grappling hook is used much by Traitors outside of a select few maps, while Detects usually buy one to dick around, wich by the way kills them more then I would like... Not to mention most areas reached by the grappling hook can be reached with propsurfing albeit it takes a bit more time messing with the props and all. So while people would be upset of its removal I doubt much gameplay gets significantly altered by its removal. On the other hand we have the Jumppack, wich has become a well renowed item and if its removed or altered it can significantly alter gameplay from what we have now wich in my opinion will affect the server negatively, or at least the most negative out of the solutions I can see so far.

Forcing staff to be on their toes watching for people abusing the exploits is... Lets just say I dont think that'll work. And if we allow them we're a bunch of hypocrites for allowing exploits onto the server.

Questioning if it should or shouldn't be allowed isnt in my mind whatsoever because I am heavily convinced that as an exploit, it shouldnt be allowed at all.

Prop surfing is not even in the question, considering it's KOS'able, potentially kills you from fall or prop damage, takes considerably longer, and some maps don't even have props suitable for it. The grappling hook has its place in the game; on maps like terror town or rooftops (which is a very popular map), the grappling hook is meta. It's not as popular as the ballistics vest or brawny brew / bold booze, but it's fairly close. No other traitor or detective equipment allows for vertical motion, and the removal of it would alter game play significantly on those maps. Also, you're discounting the grappling hook because it's used quite frequently to dick around, but that's exactly why it shouldn't be removed. The grappling hook is a lot fun to use, whether you're using the exploit or not, and, you know, the whole point of this game is to have fun. If people are having fun on a server, they tend to come back.

I agree with you that we shouldn't ask staff to do more than the little they actually do, but in terms of allowing the exploit, it really isn't that bad. I'd venture to say almost all of the times someone uses the exploit, they're doing it randomly to fly around the map because it's FUN. Using the exploit has its detriments as well, as I've listed before; it's not like you can't be killed while using it, because it leaves you very vulnerable at predictable intervals.
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#23
I'm seeing this case become something else similar now.

Hey, lets remove the grapple because the Jump Jet was added and lets people abuse the grapple, even though the grapple is a key part of the game. We don't need original parts of the game interfering with an item crutch to get around needing to understand how ladders work.

Hey, lets remove heads from the game because head shots don't work when someone wears the Face Punch hat. No, wait, that isn't how the headshot issue was resolved, but it is how you are laying out your case for removing the grapple now.
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Groovy
#24
(10-17-2018, 05:01 PM)Cosmic Tortoise Wrote: I'm seeing this case become something else similar now.

Hey, lets remove the grapple because the Jump Jet was added and lets people abuse the grapple, even though the grapple is a key part of the game.  We don't need original parts of the game interfering with an item crutch to get around needing to understand how ladders work.

Hey, lets remove heads from the game because head shots don't work when someone wears the Face Punch hat.  No, wait, that isn't how the headshot issue was resolved, but it is how you are laying out your case for removing the grapple now.

I don't know what TTT server you're playing, but the grapple hook is NOT a key part of TTT. Neither is the jump pack.
#25
(10-17-2018, 05:26 PM)Laced Xanax Wrote:
(10-17-2018, 05:01 PM)Cosmic Tortoise Wrote: I'm seeing this case become something else similar now.

Hey, lets remove the grapple because the Jump Jet was added and lets people abuse the grapple, even though the grapple is a key part of the game.  We don't need original parts of the game interfering with an item crutch to get around needing to understand how ladders work.

Hey, lets remove heads from the game because head shots don't work when someone wears the Face Punch hat.  No, wait, that isn't how the headshot issue was resolved, but it is how you are laying out your case for removing the grapple now.

I don't know what TTT server you're playing, but the grapple hook is NOT a key part of TTT. Neither is the jump pack.
^
This

Dinkleberg’s TTT is the first TTT server that I came across that has the grappling hook and/or the jetpack.
Greetings, 
Swartsy
#26
It may not be a key part of the TTT game mode, but it's a key part of Dinkleberg's TTT.
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#27
the jumpack does not keep players here and neither does the grapple hook people only use it because it's fun but the server would be better off without them because more maps and less exploiting for everyone imo
#28
Hey badmins, are you gonna, you know, give some input?
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#29
Here's a Strawpoll to help out the admins, vote if you want.
https://www.strawpoll.me/16673835/
#30
(10-17-2018, 08:41 AM)Trombowen Wrote: You know, a good place to start with this thread (because we haven't started by the way, you guys have just been droning on about the Jump Pack, which will not be changed) would be to actually acknowledge the question of whether we should allow it or disallow it. The only person to actually acknowledge this question is @Swartsy, which is kind of sad considering there are currently 19 posts on this thread.

Before we start, just know there will be consequences for each potential outcome. If we remove the grappling hook, we'll be removing one of the most used traitor and detective equipment. If we disallow all forms of the exploit, it'll be hard to enforce it, considering the exploits are already very popular and hard to prove without video evidence. If we allow all forms of the exploit, the grappling hook would only be used for high mobility and rarely used to get kills. If I had to choose however, I would just choose to allow it, considering it would take some pressure off of the staff (although it's not like they anything on duty anyway), and it involves the least amount of change. Radical change, like removing the Jump Pack, is not good by the way.

When you try to keep the thread on topic, but everyone keeps going off on a tangent with the Jump Pack.
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