[Damien1579]

I feel like this thread could probably have been closed when Levi responded, no need to keep dragging things on.

We all understand that one side has no evidence of wrong doing and the other side has no evidence of wrong doing. Things don't need to be repeated over and over, nobody's gonna admit to anything or suddenly agree with one side or the other of the argument.

[StrenuousSpider]

[snip] didnt read any of that shit. I really cant believe any of this is getting stretched out since its clear that there is no evidence from your side.
also im not really responding, just unpacking some thoughts I had at the beginning but wanted to say a bit more nicely.

first off, community bans are pretty much saved for people who break the law/come close to it, like PDF files, cyberstalkers, and people who creep on others in the DMs (to my knowledge).
so demanding one is honestly really funny and sad that you are making a false equivalency of this to that.

Second off (and rant/ramble):

so let me get this right.

you (spider) are saying the following:
you (spider) are experiencing years long harassment from levi, that has somehow manifested due to receiving a ban for RDM.
You(spider) are claiming this ban came from nowhere.
You(spider) are claiming you did nothing wrong, and thus the ban is false.

as a result, you are demanding that someone be community banned.

and let me ask you this:
would you agree with the following:
person A and B are not friends.
Person B joins the server.
Person A tells B "go away, this is my server"
Person A starts harassing B every round by damaging B.
Person A is also friends with C, D, E, ETC.
C,D, and E do not tell person A to stop bothering B.

if you had a problem with my behavior in the 2(?) year old post, the rats one, then you should have an issue with the behavior I described. after all, it is similar behavior to what I just described, minus the "get off server, this is my server". 

(since we've opened that can of worms), if you had a problem with my behavior during the rats scenario, then why did you not have a single issue with your friends in this scenario?
Clearly, you know that popcorning people in the head is annoying. So do your friends, since that has been a bitterly complained topic in the past.
And you know that RDM is wrong. so does everyone.

Another question set:
So if person F attempts RDM on person G, is that suddenly not wrong? It would have been RDM had person F died. So does person F not dying suddenly make it OK to do?

And if F engages in behavior that could potentially kill person G and the behavior is known to be irritable in general, and F does this consistently, is this not harassment (via ARDM)?

and if it was popcorn to the head, is that not Attempted RDM? after all, buckets that hit someone in the head currently deal damage and can kill.

in summary, at least one of your group was tossing popcorn at my head or shoving me for almost every round for the first map played. if that had been you getting popcorned and shoved, wouldn't you feel harassed? after all, you can see in the video I basically stop "playing" murder and start playing "try to dodge getting killed by popcorn". 

Then, following on that, I noticed a distinct lack of "hey mabye we should stop".
it follows that people can be complicit in something by failing to act.
Since apparently we are insistent on having only the highest standards in this thread, should that not mean that you too should have stopped your friends from doing that? and that a failure to do so is complicity?
obviously, that is stupid.

is it true you were swept up in a group ban that had a generic reason? yeah, thats probably true honestly.

what isn't true is that your friends didnt harass me. they very much did. and they did so with ARDM. just because something isn't by word in the rule does not make it allowed or not allowed.
For example, if I popped into murder and started to spam an obscure slur like g**k, I probably would catch a permanent ban off the rip, even though thats not in the rules by word.
If I came into the server, and somehow flung props at someone and brought them to like 1 HP and they died going down map geometry, I'd probably get punished for RDM since I am a majority cause of the damage.

Hell, lets flip over to the TTT rules to help define RDM/ARDM
in TTT rdm is fully killing another player. Ardm is when you damage another player, and is more easily defined as shooting to attempt/attempting to damage someone, for example, with a barrel.
TTT and murder share very similar design. (overarching, big ideas design yall).
so would it not track that if its ARDM on TTT, its likely ARDM on Murder? and that Ardm leads to RDM if the kill occurs?



 how can I not interpret the popcorn and pushing as harassment when its paired with a hostile statement and paired with the fact that I am provably not friends with you at the moment. And for that matter, you know popcorn ARDM can be/is mean, and you had an issue with harassing, so why didnt you stop your friends from carrying out this behavior? 

I do agree, you got banned wrongly.
But you've been unbanned and the rules will change to have better ability to enforce them and to be more clear. I've spoken with Levi about this on length.

clearly, after being banned we are suddenly talking after 2 years, and you messaged me as if we are friends (?).(I have, already, preserved all our DMs so, really, don't delete them. Or do. up to you tbh.)


with all that said, considering how I felt about your group popcorning me in the head for a full map, constantly shoving me, and softlocking me on my murderer round, can you understand my perspective on the matter? How am I supposed to interpret your most recent comm with me? to me, it seemed like there was some ulterior motive and that you were leveraging reviving the friendship with you to obtain footage from me. It seemed like you are reaching out to me in bad faith. It honestly seemed like you are doing this for some other reason that isnt just about undoing the ban.

that's not how friends behave to each other. If we are friends, then lets mend that bridge. If we aren't going to be friends, that fine as well. But do not use the promise of friendship to leverage things out of people. that's weird and manipulative. the tone shift is a huge fucking neck breaking experience.


I checked my footage and saw I had one real file and one file that was corrupted and unuseable. I immediately concluded that if I say/send nothing, you will be upset, and if I send what I have, you will still be upset. Ultimately, you would/did blame me for 'colluding' with Levi, and at that point, I simply opted to sit for a bit.
I didnt collude with Levi. I simply turned over evidence from map 1 once it had processed, stating ARDM consistent.

again, its true you didnt participate in the ARDM. And for that, I am actually not mad with you. I actually called that out to Levi in private quickly.

what I am, however, is disappointed. That, after 2 years, you would attempt to leverage reviving the friendship for the sole purpose of getting video out of me for some purpose. And that when I didn't respond, to sleep on it, you immediately assumed the worst, made accusations about me. That although you approached me in a friendly manner, you didn't behave like a friend on server after two years of no contact.

tldr - agree ban is wrong FOR YOU (then file it in unbans...), hard disagree on persistent harassment from levi to you. Have many questions about your behavior towards me and how it feels manipulative. Have many questions why its OK for your friend group to troll others, but complain bitterly when any trolling occurs to your group.
curious.


not responding to anyone. just had more time to unpack and un-nice-ify what I wanted to say initially.

anyway, back to ignoring this thread. or mabye i'll actually read it so it can hit 10 pages like the annual dinks drama requires. (joking on this one, please close thread).
I really do question the motive behind this whole thread keep chugging along from your involvement. Its clearly not about you being harassed, that's for sure. If it was, there would be a tangible trail of evidence of harassment, which there really is not from the screenshots to be honest with you. did YOU recieve an incorrect ban? yeah, but it was fixed. Poor wording immediately afterwords? absolutely. Harassment? the word stretch is itself stretching.

anyway, someone close this thread, its not gonna go anywhere productive.
and Im not gonna respond to anyone unless they include a goofy shitpost as well that was made with love and care(or hate and indifference, really just include a funny one unrelated to this topic). k, thanks. Bye.











anyway, heres a shitpost so I too am shitposting:

Code:

|^^^^^^^^^^^^^^||____
|.The WHO GIVES A | ||'""|""\_ _
| __ FUCK TRUCK __ l ||__|__|__|)
|(@)(@)****(@)(@)****|(@)**(@)

(anyway, now, really, k, thanks, bye.)

Quite the amount of bullshit being spewed here.. NOWHERE DID I EVER COMPARE LEVI SITUATION TO A FUCKING PEDOFILE, so keep that shit at the fucking door.. Genuine POS type reply to even suggest that

Again the years of is towards Phantom specifically. The rest is probably around a year or so, not multiple as we have been gone for that time when all this really started to become a issue. Yes the ban is false, and yes i did nothing, yes phantom did nothing that amount to any rules being broken. Popcorn throws and pushing is only a rule break if someone has told them to stop. Hence why Corilly is no longer here. You never made such claim until after levi was around. YOU YOURSELF as seen in the video YOU YOURSELF posted, are seen repeatedly pushing me, something you started with me damn near the second you got on. the same shit you did when you got on that alt that day.. So dont you dare act all innocent, especially when you are the only one with a RDM on Evidence which id assume nothing was done about? So no i wont tell someone to stop bothering someone when someone does not make it clear they did not want it done, i will not tell them to stop when you yourself are joining in on it as well.. 
Nothing about the two situations are the same. one is us on, you coming on, pushing we push, you say nothing, you call staff with claims of RDM manipulating shit that you again were part of.. That is nowhere near the same situation as YOU, NORM, and LEVI getting on alt account to as publicly admitted to, coming on just to troll.. They are nowhere near the same and you and levi are both at the core of both issues.

Popcorn hits have never been a thing thats considered ARDM as you two claim.. everyone on this server has thrown those around.. So prove in anyway that you getting hit with it from time to time is attempting to kill you. Especially when we know you record? In other words its not attempt at any damn thing.. IN FACT, i have the clip that yall try to say is ARMD from by side, Phantom never hit you from the top like you claim and like levi claims, Ill gladly send it to anyone that wants to see, More then happy to even... Your video shows nothing of DODGE the POPCORN like you claim.. it does show you getting hit from time to time, but it also shows you shoving people and around and RDMing..

Once again you never made any attempt to voice you wanted them to stop.. You have a mic, say something and then i could try to reel them in.. But only saying it once Levi gets on, thats manipulative.. Again no reason for the ban on anyones part, no rule was broken and no evidence of it either.

Racism is clearly stated in the rules but nice try.. Hitting someone and then they fall from fall damage? Not on you, you did not kill them.. you can play semantics all you want, you did not kill them.. This is MURDER not TTT, STICK TO THE TOPIC AND GAME MODES RULES or dont comment about it. ARDM NOT A THING HERE.

Ill be more then happy to post all our DMs, you act like i got shit to hide on there.. post them all you want brother it matters not to me lmfao, what a joke. I came to you peacefully despite our past, does not mean i was coming to you as a friend.. Being friends and being friendly is not one in the same. So no, no attempts at leverage was made. If you didnt have it, you didnt have it that simple. you act like id blow up about.. Did not having the footage stop me... no it did not.. But its nice of you to assume i would.. Ya know the fact that you said that shit about my mother that day and i did not snap on you even then should have been enough for you to know i would not have reacted badly like you try to claim.. Remember those DM, i do... Again i asked if you were recording, never once did i try to be friends with you again, i dont want to be in the same room as you for what thats worth.. So again, Being Friendly is not the same as being friends or trying to be friends. Another note, i came to you because you were.. 1. on when it happened, and 2 Always recording for whatever reason...

Again no trolling was done to you, You got on that day with them to troll and harass us and then get us punished for it.. With this case, you came on pushing just like the rest of them, thats not trolling when you both are doing it.. again your video shows you doing just that to me, and me back.. Does not mean friends but being friendly.. You can claim phantoms statement was hostile, but it still does not fall under the murders rules of harassment.. Again if you knew the rules you should have said stop and then from there it would be harassment. rules are rules..

But nice try manipulating things, and nice DM leak threat as well...

Community ban is what i came here for, if that dont happen then so be it.. but something needs done, even if its a murder ban or being kicked from murder staff..

[MysticalElfWarrior]

I wasn’t going to respond, but this has gone too far. I have better things to focus on than childish behavior, and since I didn’t hear everything that happened while I was watching, I’m not taking sides. But I will say this—this bullying needs to stop immediately. It doesn’t matter which side you think is responsible; at the end of the day, it needs to end.

The constant back-and-forth is immature, repetitive, and completely unnecessary. It’s creating a negative environment for everyone involved.

Murder is supposed to be about having fun and being a safe, respectful space for every player, and right now it’s the opposite. If this continues, it’s only going to ruin the experience for everyone. Enough is enough—drop it and move on.

[Ryan]

Locking this. This report has been raised to the supreme court. We will get back to you once we are back in session (soon).

[Super Milk Chan]

At this time the admin team has agreed unanimously that there isn’t evidence for an abuse report to stick. However, we will warn and remind Lost_Leviathan in regard to their priorities as admin; recordings failing to save and or otherwise is something I think we have all dealt with, however at the very least after the ban you should have checked and unbanned if you made a simple mistake, as mentioned by chibill. This did not take place until after a talk we had about the way lost came off in discord when responding to people in regard to this situation, that being very different from their tone in voice chat, even though it was made abundantly clear early into that interaction, that they came off as very hostile.

Regarding that conversation we had Lost I can clearly see in your response and decision to lift the bans (which is something none of the admins suggested) that you have in fact taken the conversation to heart, but we need to see more attempts as solving the problem before resorting to a permanent ban for minor infractions accumulated over a thousand years with wide gaps. I hope both parties can move forward and work together as the murder community is small and need each other to get off the ground.

In conclusion Lost_Leviathan you need to consider community building a lot more moving forward, you and everyone else are more than welcome to reach out to the wider admin team for guidance.