[HONG]

snip

overstaffing causes more problems and more problematic people that's all I got for ya

huh, maybe this is why you’re (one of) the good discord staff

[Damien]

As someone with a "dark" sense of humor I think the discord staff do a great job at handling most if not all situations. Of course, you can't have a rule for every scenario imaginable, you can't read minds and you can't predict what people are gonna do. I think the team might be a little quick to ban people (The "Kebab" situation, The "Mall" Incident) but the team has done an overall good job.

[YourMateMurph]

Why don’t we just make a Skype or teamspeak instead of discord :)

[Noire ♜]

Regardless of the validity of Happy's Dinkleberg quote, it's still a really good quote. The idea of that level of staffing is something that we should strive for, regardless of whether or not he was being nice while denying an applicant. I feel as though completely disregarding what is in the post due to the applicant's personality is silly.

With that being said, overstaffing is an issue we had on TTT for a little bit and the only thing that overstaffing did is perpetuate the problems at hand, i.e. ape gang, @bryanbrr. I am sure that overstaffing happens on PH as well. And here's where we segue into the main idea of this post. The levels of "overstaffing" are completely different on both servers. To a good chunk of TTT players, I am sure that most PH staff, whether that be in the discord or on the forums, or on the server itself see you all as that failed applicant, which I'm sure says a lot. 

The entire idea of staffing should not rely solely on set guidelines and rules, nor should staff lean on their methods of punishment in order to staff. The entire idea of staffing is being there just in case. Being there as a last-ditch effort in order to maintain a fun environment for everyone, this of course is where the problems start to ensue. If you overstaff you start making enemies, quickly and while banning all of them is an option, we can see that it doesn't work, ever. You get a large group of people that live only to make the staff's life difficult. On the other hand, if you are too lenient while staffing you start to have a loud, rambunxious environment that can get out of hand too quickly that you cannot control. The goal of all staff, on all servers, should be to find this beautiful middle ground. If you're not looking for this middle ground you shouldn't be staff. If you cannot function outside of a set of rules or guidelines, you should not be staff on any of the servers. 

You gotta keep the discord clean because we're public, but you don't have to be a jackoff while doing that.

[Ckg]

The levels of "overstaffing" are completely different on both servers. To a good chunk of TTT players, I am sure that most PH staff, whether that be in the discord or on the forums, or on the server itself see you all as that failed applicant, which I'm sure says a lot. 

I normally didn't intend to write a response to my post but what Noire brought up here just recently had an almost perfect example.  The difference in sentiments between PH and TTT are evident in Shaye's recent discord unban request.  A lot of what I thought needed to be addressed was evident in the comments of this unban app.  The overwhelming majority of the TTT players that commented on it felt that the ban was unjustified while the PH player(s) were/was in full support of it, and while it's easy to attempt to deflect the TTT players argument by saying it was an auto-ban based on warns instead of an outright ban itself, I'd say that most of the same players would disagree with the warn itself.

Another great example from this thread was from a PH staff who equated to common joke of TTT players telling PH players to go back to the PH server to:
"eww, its fucking biig_sad. Fucking prophunt staff  , keep yourself safe" is not (I do not remember exactly what was said, but this is an approximation of it)
This shows how differently the servers handle and interpret perceived "toxicity".  Where something like that joke is commonplace in TTT and, as most would agree, fairly low down on the toxicity scale for what gets said in TTT server, to a player coming from the more heavily moderated PH server it easily felt like targeting.  To imply that the aforementioned joke "leads to bullying and hate" and that it's other players' duty to defend you (In reference to: "Then, nobody defends you because its seen as a joke to others, and you decide not to raise the issue as the people eventually leave.") is not a sentiment shared widely by most of the TTT player base.  This is because the standards of "bullying and hate" are so different on the servers and, while, I hate to keep harping on this over-referenced (and I believe no longer in effect) rule the "shut up" demonstrates this perfectly.  Never in a million years would a rule like be placed near the TTT server, because what is defined as "toxic" over in PH is comparatively little to TTT players.  Now, this isn't meant to be an attack on the PH staff member who posted this, but a sentiment like: "you should seriously consider how what you say, even if its a "ha ha, funni" comment, can have big impacts.", perfectly illustrates the difference in mindsets the two servers have and why this issue needed to be brought to the attention of the community.

---

Also, separately from my previous point, trying to deny the fact the TTT community is geared to an older audience than PH by pointing that occasionally children play TTT is a non sequitur and is, in my opinion, an example of being intentionally dense and using semantics to try get a "slam dunk" on the people you are disagreeing with.

(for reference for this point refer to @BIIG_SAD's comment on the thread mentioned in my previous reply: "Age-gating the communities is outright hostile and only ends poorly. I have seen literal children playing TTT in the TTT server, so you cannot categorically call it an "adult" community.)

[Icey]

If you break the rules and staff does something about it, just cope and move on.

[matt_st3 (Strongrule)]

Too many people are so adamant about TTT vs PH and will not stop to realize everything they’re complaining about came from a ttt admin or other such staff. Outside of that discord runs off of its own rules, many of which come from discord TOS.
And small history reminder, DR and Murder heads were both PH originally.

[dong]

I feel like the main thing I’ve noticed in game and on discord is the lack of verbal/written warning prior to the punishment(s). I’d like to say I’m pretty lenient, but I feel like most “drama” right now stems from just instantly punishing people rather than saying “come on man don’t do that,” and then striking them if they do it again. Use the guidelines as as stepping stone, but unless something is a major violation I don’t find it reasonable to punish every single time someone messes up. Noire said something last night in vc that really resonated with me,”people don’t even think of each other as people anymore, they just see a name and rank/color.” That statement goes both ways, but it is so true. I feel like if we all just empathized with each other more we’d be better off. This is a video game and the chances of you interacting with any of us outside of here are extremely unlikely, so just try and have fun here..

[Noire ♜]

also don't look at this thread as ph vs ttt  ---- I don't think it was ever meant to pit the servers against each other. I think that we need to understand our differences, which there are a lot that the two servers have, and come together at a point in the middle, especially on discord and the forums where both servers interact together.
Instead, look at this forum post objectively, without all of the "PH VS TTT" bullshit. There are good points made here, too good to just be shoveled along with the rest of the bullshit.

So, my grand plan? What is it? What will unite all of the servers under one big banner?? We go to this one hill in Italy.



The other option is we resurrect Michael Jackson to do a "We Are the World" but for Dinkleberg's Gmod servers. Either one works for me.

[Battons]

I personally don’t think overstaffing is the issue more the lack of clear punishments or escalation is what’s causing more people to be confused and think it could be solved much like dong said. Genuinely very good comment and believe everyone could use some self reflection reading it.